We're anxious to build but having sticker shock...

I've seen a few posts here over time that ask why modern homes are so expensive but I haven't seen much to go into depth as to why.  Outside of architect fees why are they so expensive?  If you look at most modern homes they are very simplistic boxes put together with a lot of glass.   Living in Minnesota and seeing modern prefab for $250-$350 sq/ft is ridiculous.  I keep putting off building a new home because it doesn't seem like I'll be able to build the modern home of my dreams even though it's very simplistic.  It seems the only solution companies have for making a modern house affordable is to reduce the square footage so much that anyone with kids couldn't call it home.  Can someone explain this to me before I go out of my mind?  What are the major costs...labor, glass, concrete, ... and are these high costs really justified?

Thanks.

Any one off custom home is going to be expensive, modern or not for the following reasons. The architectural fee is only a small portion of the extra cost. Lack of economy of scale since it is a one off design/construction. Modern usually means details that are more complex, sometimes it is more complex to make something look clean and simple. Non-Standard materials, while the materials may be cheaper the labor is more expensive since subcontractors may not be familiar with the installation. Typically, the modern home is not 6000+ sqft so you are paying allot for the walls and not amortizing it over allot of square footage. One other big reason, hedging risk, any builder is going to throw extra money at something they are not fully sure of, CYA affect. As for the cost of the Pre-Fab, well that is beyond me, pre-fab is supposed to solve allot of the issues mentioned above and yet they still come out to a far too high /sqft cost in my opinion. Best bet would be to set a reasonable budget (with a contingency) and set to design the home based on that budget. With a knowledgeable architect, they will help guild you down the path of materials and design features that will fit your budget. Tell them your budget and that you are firm in meeting it (don't tell them about your contingency), then if a "must have" item that is out of your base budget arises you have the extra to cover it. In addition, look at your other costs, such as the land, maybe where you want to build is not where you can "afford" to build. It is always a challenge when money is limited and you want to squeeze every bit of value out of every penny, but some architects (myself included) love that challenge, it might just take finding the right one.

Darren, Volume builders can, in Texas, hit about $70/SF for new construction (not including land) because of economies of scale. However, one-off builders doing traditional styles are generally around $100=$120/SF for construction cost.  When you see modern homes at more than $200/SF, most of the excess over traditional style is the client's "fault." To many, modern design means really slick materials and expensive details. If you can stick to details 99% of subcontractors feel comfortable with, than a modern house should not cost much than a traditional house. This may sound good, but avoiding expensive details may be harder than it sounds. Want lots of glass? Glass is more expensive than solid wall. Want to avoid molding and trim? Expensive. Want slick modern light fixtures and cool door knobs? Expensive. Want slick European faucets and sinks? Want an open staircase? kiln-dried cedar siding? Nana-folding wall? Expensive. Expensive. Expensive. Flat roof? Expensive (more so than a 2:12 with shingles).

Ten details that each add $2 per SF will take a $100/SF house and make it $120/SF. The trick is to do this without making a$120/SF house look like it was $50/SF.

In the end, go with a modern plan and elevations with well placed windows and simple details (it is all about space and light anyway, right?) and you can get a great modern house for little more than a traditional house.

Jonathan - curious - what do you consider an architects fees to "small'' portion"? I find most pure bread modern architects to be the problem. Of course, there are exceptions but I have found architects want $40,000 to $100,000 to draw a 3,500 square foot house and they are obsessed with unqiueness - this comes at the costs of budget.

There will have to be a reinvention of the modern architect mindset before affordable modern housing can be accomplished. A production mentality will have to be introduced in order to get the scale to bring the price in line.

In Dallas, a good modern house can be build for $135-$150 per foot - less if there were 4 or 5 of them going up in one development.

If you want Frank Welch, Cunningham, Max Levy, etc., then yes you are looking at big $$ for the fee. However, there are many young architects out there with both the skill and passion to create a modern design that will cost you much less. As an example, I choose to charge by the hour (not % of construction), at what I believe is a very reasonable rate, this way if the client knows exactly what they want and are efficient in relaying that information they only pay for the time it takes to draw it up. If, however they need allot of guidance, research and numerous re-designs then it costs them more, still by the hour. I feel this is much more fair that just slapping a 15-20% premium on putting together a design. Through word of mouth and a little research, hiring a good architect can happen for a reasonable cost. Nevertheless, there are risks, I do not believe that you "get what you pay for", instead you pay for the depth of the portfolio (and rightfully so.) If you are uncomfortable using someone with only a few jobs under their belt and can only trust an architect with 100+ projects and published work, well then it is going to cost you. (If you are really adventurous, and don't mind using someone who is unregistered, hit up an Architectural Grad Student, you would be surprised at the amount of creativity and drive to do things perfect that resides within the architectural student.) The "mindset" you refer to tends to go hand in hand with what is stated above. Many younger "hungry" architects understand that modern does not have to equal costly. Current architectural teaching focuses allot on affordability and the use of simple materials in creative ways. It will take sometime for the old guard to change but I do feel over time modern will not necessarily equate to expensive.

Good point Jonathan. I was more bitching about the name brand architect snobbery. They complain at the AIA forum meeting about how poorly housing is designed, yet they don't do anything about it. They just want someone to hire them for their next portfolio piece. Never used them, never will.

So I am curious - what do you think a fair price is an for architect to draw a 3,500 square foot house? Knowing that this could vary widely on client, but assume a "normal" client that has ideas of what they want?

Hi Jason,

Most residential architects will try to work with you on fees, but keep in mind, their work product is how they feed their families.  My husband has done house plans in the 3500 sf range for around $15,000.00.  That includes client meetings, changes, and construction documents.  Spending money for a good set of plans will save you money down the road.

Another thing to keep in mind is that most builders don't build modern homes.  They build the cookie cutter houses that they can crank out.   Their sub contractors are not familiar with modern home design/construction, so the contractor has trouble controlling his subs.

Also, regardless of "clean lines", many modern finishes are EXPENSIVE.  Like stated before, glass is more expensive than a framed wall.  For one thing, serious engineering comes into play.  Another thing, window walls may require commercial storefront windows, which are EXPENSIVE.  I know, because our last house (designed and built by my husband) was 3400 square feet on one level with commercial storefront windows, flat roofs, etc. 

And drywall.......let me tell you about drywall.  Most builders slap up the drywall, spray on the texture, prime and paint.  Most modern design lovers want a LEVEL 5 SMOOTH WALL.  This is VERY difficult, time consuming and, of course, EXPENSIVE.  Some drywallers can't even do it.

Polished concrete floors...EXPENSIVE.  Italian light fixtures.....EXPENSIVE.  Modern cabinets, doors,  fixtures.....EXPENSIVE!

All that said, I believe its possible to reduce alot the costs if you are willing to compromise on some major issues.  That's where an architect can help you.  Tell the designer you do not want window walls, but would like to gain the FEEL of window walls.  Instead of Italian light fixtures, use SIMPLE button fixtures and track lighting.

Just keep in mind that contractors are in the profit making business.  They make money building what they know how to build and having someone buy it.  If they have to learn each new step, it cuts into their profit and they will have to pass that cost on to you.

Good luck!

 

Previously Jason wrote:

Good point Jonathan. I was more bitching about the name brand architect snobbery. They complain at the AIA forum meeting about how poorly housing is designed, yet they don't do anything about it. They just want someone to hire them for their next portfolio piece. Never used them, never will.

So I am curious - what do you think a fair price is an for architect to draw a 3,500 square foot house? Knowing that this could vary widely on client, but assume a "normal" client that has ideas of what they want?

 

Now this is just throwing out numbers but here are my thoughts: 3,500sqft + Reasonable Client who has a good idea what they want but is not playing “closet architect.” Closet Architects are probably the most difficult and time-consuming client to work with. What is helpful is for the client to have a good idea for their expectations and space requirements as well as have done some research into what materials and fixtures/finishes they prefer. Pre-design and programming of the space = 5 hours Materials and Design research = 15 hours Preliminary sketches and Layout = 10 hours Developed Floor Plan and elevations with client input = 15 hours Final Construction Documents = 25 hours Project Management (Includes selection of builder, permitting, and Construction Administration – will vary greatly with project) = 50 hours Total Hours = 120 I typically charge $100 per hour (this can be client and situation dependent) 120 x $100 = $12,000 out the door. (This does not include any engineering fees for slab/structural design; this is required to be designed/sealed by a licensed engineer) (This is all qualified by who the client is. As stated before I charge by the hour, and I am a fast worker, but given a reasonable client, I think this is fair.) Not to toot my own horn but what I add, besides design talent, is a very developed skill set in contracts, project management and construction administration, probably much more so than your typical young architect. Personally, I like to work with the client very closely with materials selection and getting exactly what “they” want. This can add hours and charges to the project but it also is money well spent. The other qualification is schedule, I do design work for fun, my day job is Program/Project Management so for me the client has to be willing to also work with my schedule if you will, this means meeting on the weekends and in the evenings. So, in my opinion I would feel comfortable that I could design a modern home in the 3000-3500 sqft range for $10,000 - $15,000, and help you get the thing built (not bad for a $400,000 - $500,000 home.)

@ Jacqueline McArthur - I am involved in the modern home design/build business and don't do polished concrete floors (too stark and cold), Italian light fixtures (too expensive) and modern kitchen cabinets are not expensive. Modern houses are not expensive to build. The reason they are typically more than a tract house is because they are one off and not production builds. They also have by nature slightly better finishes. Italian lighting and walls of glass are a luxury - not a requirement.

@ Johnathan - thanks for the break down of information. Very informative.

Modern homes are expensive because of a few important factors, among them 

(1) You are usually asking contractors to assemble with materials they are unfamiliar with or in an unfamiliar way with materials they know.

(2) You, as the client, do not have the self-control you need to limit your expenses regarding finishes and size of house. This is really difficult, I've been there.

I suggest you take a look at my thread entitled: "Thank You, Livemodern". This will give you some ideas as far as ways to limit your expenses, but still get a modern home. I've been in mine for a little over a year and am very happy with it, even with all the tough choices I had to make regarding finishes and layout, etc. 

Additionally, I believe my Architect's fees were in the $10K to 15K range, and not a day goes by in this house that I don't appreciate what they brought to the table. 

 -R.

It does take a bit of effort.  Thanks for laying out the info on fees.  I have been quoted up to 80k in arch fees for a 3500-4000 sq ft project, ouch.  I'll be shopping around.  I've been doing a lot of research and design on my own and have a pretty good idea of the plan.  Just need the next level of help to get'er done.

I do want to clarify a few points about the fee. For me the fee I charge is low for two major reasons. Primarily I do home design because I enjoy it, and it is not my major source of income. In addition, two, my overhead is extremely low i.e. some paper, pencils, a laptop and me. If requested I will also build a nice, detailed scale model of the home (typically out of bass wood) for additional fee. If you go to a true multi-architect firm and expect to get a full home designed for this price good luck. It could easily cost you two or three times as much, and if you live in another part of the country (Texas is cheap) probably even more. If you live in the NE and are looking to hire a noted firm to design your 4000sqft modern dream home $80k would not surprise me. I posted what I did more for those who swear that using an architect is not viable, I have always argued that the cost of the architect is minimal compared to having a truly custom house designed for your needs and lifestyle. The sad fact is most people spend more effort researching and choosing their car than they do their home.

Hi Jason,

I can attest that polished concrete floors, with hot water radiant heat, are ANYTHING but stark and cold.  I have 3 active children and they are a dream.  Of course, you have to make the decisions for your home and budget.  I still suggest that you hire a good architect, it will make your life much easier.  I think Jonathan would be a great person to consult with.

Good luck with your project!

Jacque

 

Previously Jason wrote:

@ Jacqueline McArthur - I am involved in the modern home design/build business and don't do polished concrete floors (too stark and cold), Italian light fixtures (too expensive) and modern kitchen cabinets are not expensive. Modern houses are not expensive to build. The reason they are typically more than a tract house is because they are one off and not production builds. They also have by nature slightly better finishes. Italian lighting and walls of glass are a luxury - not a requirement.

@ Johnathan - thanks for the break down of information. Very informative.

 

Richirod you always know how to say things in the right way!  And you did build a fantastici house!

 

Previously richierod wrote:

Modern homes are expensive because of a few important factors, among them 

(1) You are usually asking contractors to assemble with materials they are unfamiliar with or in an unfamiliar way with materials they know.

(2) You, as the client, do not have the self-control you need to limit your expenses regarding finishes and size of house. This is really difficult, I've been there.

I suggest you take a look at my thread entitled: "Thank You, Livemodern". This will give you some ideas as far as ways to limit your expenses, but still get a modern home. I've been in mine for a little over a year and am very happy with it, even with all the tough choices I had to make regarding finishes and layout, etc. 

Additionally, I believe my Architect's fees were in the $10K to 15K range, and not a day goes by in this house that I don't appreciate what they brought to the table. 

 -R.

 

Well said!  My husband is a commercial architect that will do home design on a case by case basis, when he has time.  So, I understand why your fees are so reasonable! 

 

Previously Jonathan Oltmann wrote:

I do want to clarify a few points about the fee. For me the fee I charge is low for two major reasons. Primarily I do home design because I enjoy it, and it is not my major source of income. In addition, two, my overhead is extremely low i.e. some paper, pencils, a laptop and me. If requested I will also build a nice, detailed scale model of the home (typically out of bass wood) for additional fee.

If you go to a true multi-architect firm and expect to get a full home designed for this price good luck. It could easily cost you two or three times as much, and if you live in another part of the country (Texas is cheap) probably even more. If you live in the NE and are looking to hire a noted firm to design your 4000sqft modern dream home $80k would not surprise me.

I posted what I did more for those who swear that using an architect is not viable, I have always argued that the cost of the architect is minimal compared to having a truly custom house designed for your needs and lifestyle. The sad fact is most people spend more effort researching and choosing their car than they do their home.

 

Jacque,

Like I said, I am already in the modern home design/build business. You are preaching to the choir.

Jason

 

 

Previously Jacqueline McArthur wrote:

Hi Jason,

I can attest that polished concrete floors, with hot water radiant heat, are ANYTHING but stark and cold.  I have 3 active children and they are a dream.  Of course, you have to make the decisions for your home and budget.  I still suggest that you hire a good architect, it will make your life much easier.  I think Jonathan would be a great person to consult with.

Good luck with your project!

Jacque